Cleaning up messes.

   Today's Buffalo News Opinion page sez:

- Honduras poses a test
   President Obama is facing his toughest test yet in Central America, the June 28 coup against President Manuel Zelaya in Honduras [right]. Whether he passes that test may depend upon how he responds to baiting by Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez.
   [News update. Editorial commentary from The Arizona Republic, The Dallas Morning News, The Poughkeepsie Journal, The Nation and The Wall Street Journal. Statements from The White House and SoS Hillary Clinton's news conference with video.]     

- Improve jail care
    There have been far too many suggestions in recent years that people in the custody of the Erie County Holding Center were not getting the kind of attention they need. ... That’s why it is good news that the Erie County Legislature, at the urging of County Executive Chris Collins, has moved to put the county’s doctor — Health Commissioner Anthony J. Billittier IV — in charge of the health care provided to the inmates of the downtown holding center and the Erie County Correctional Facility in Alden.

- State must change rules on lieutenant governorship 
   by State Assemblyman Robin Schimminger
   A little over a year ago, the Rockefeller Institute of Government held a public policy forum on “Gubernatorial Succession and the Powers of the Lieutenant Governor.” We were then two months into the current vacancy in the lieutenant governor’s office created when then-Lt.Gov. David A. Paterson replaced Eliot L. Spitzer as governor.

-  Mom’s love of garden finally takes root 
   by Pam Henel
   It is a labor of love to tend a garden, or a child. It requires time, thought, and diligence. It especially requires patience, waiting and watching as your plants or children grow. Truly a labor of love, but the rewards are bountiful, and bring joy to your soul.

-- George Pyle/The Buffalo News
[Map of Honduras from www.cia.gov and its World Factbook, one of the coolest Web sites out there.]   

Comments

[Buffalo Libertarian]

Obama, the UN and the media are wrong on Honduras! The military, the Congress and the Supreme Court of Honduras followed their country's Constitution in removing Zelaya from power. It was Zelaya who was violating the Constitution.

Of course, Obama, the UN, the media - and most Americans for that matter - don't give a rat's behind about the Constitution - whether Honduras' or ours.

Has anyone noticed how Obama, the UN and the media all seem to be siding more and more with left wing dictators and less and less with the rule of law?

[gravedancer]

An Obama quote from his Russian speech yesterday: "And then, within a few short years, the world as it was ceased to be. Now, make no mistake: This change did not come from any one nation. The Cold War reached a conclusion because of the actions of many nations over many years, and because the people of Russia and Eastern Europe stood up and decided that its end would be peaceful." If this is an example of how our current president views history, it is no wonder that now up is down, black is white, wrong is right, and legal is now illegal. God help us...

[Question for George]

George, Do you agree it was a big omission for the BN editorial to not even mention both the Hondouran Congress and the Hondouran Supreme Court strongly support the removal of Zelaya?

Why should the opinion of Obama about this be more important than the courts and elected national legislature in that nation?

Shouldn't the editorial at least have taken that into account? By mentioning only the army, implying it was acting on its own, wasn't the editorial very misleading? Isn't some clarification in order?

From the WaPo:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/28/AR2009062800635.html

"...But the Honduran National Congress defiantly announced that Zelaya was out, and its members named congressional leader Roberto Micheletti the new president on Sunday afternoon.

The Honduran Supreme Court also supported the removal of Zelaya, saying that the military was acting in defense of democracy. ..."

[George Pyle]

I would not disagree that those points deserved mention. But, if we had taken the space to do so, we should also have said that whatever the Congress and Supreme Court said AFTER the coup would not count for very much, given who was holding the guns and where they were pointed.

We said Zelaya's own plans were not good. But does every bad idea justify a military insurrection?

It was still a military coup, and military coups are bad. Period.

If Congress and/or the Supreme Court had cause to remove their elected president, they should have at least tried to use constitutional means to do so and not hide behind the army.

To me, personally, the whole thing reeks of the fact that President Z actually threw a few bones to the poor of his country, and in this hemisphere that's enough to get you called a leftist or, gasp, a socialist.

[Buffalo Libertarian]

George, are you another of those people who think that constitutions aren't worth the paper they're printed on?

Zelaya was in violation of his country's constitution and, under that country's constitution, that was sufficient grounds for his removal from office. I wish our founding fathers had put in our Constitution consequences for violating it. In a constitutional republic (like the United States and Honduras) the Constitution is the supreme law of the land - people like you and Obama seem to be incapable of understanding that.

Do you really believe that a military carrying out its sworn oath to uphold the Constitution is a coup?

[Rick]

Zelaya attempted to follow the same path that Chavez followed. The coup came after Zelaya's plans were rejected by the Honduran Supreme Court, and Chavez was in the process of trying to help Zelaya do in Honduras what he'd done in Venezuela. If you want to be like Obama, and find yourself on the wrong side of history on this (it's amazing how quickly he had a statement on this but couldn't come out in opposition to the actions in Iran), feel free. And, Zelaya didn't "throw a few bones to the poor" out of any sympathy. He did so in order to buy votes, much the same way Chavez did. We saw how this movie ended in 1998. Some of us recall the lessons. Some, like the News, need to re-learn them I suppose.

[Next question for George]

"But, if we had taken the space to do so..."

Implying lack of space???? Come on, George. A sentence or two of that editorial easily could and should have been sacrificed to make room. The omission was major and gave a very misleading presentation of the major facts.

Also, isn't your comment here misrepresenting the timing of the Supreme Court's position? Didn't it happen before the arrest (see below), not afterward as your comment not-so-subtly implies?

You wrote: "we should also have said that whatever the Congress and Supreme Court said AFTER the coup would not count for very much, given who was holding the guns and where they were pointed."

However:

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601086&sid=axGENUiy9yKs

"July 1 (Bloomberg) -- Honduras’s military acted under judicial orders in deposing President Manuel Zelaya, Supreme Court Justice Rosalinda Cruz said, rejecting the view of President Barack Obama and other leaders that he was toppled in a coup.

Cruz said the court issued a sealed arrest order for Zelaya on June 26 [note: prior to Zelaya's arrest], charging him with treason and abuse of power, among other offenses. Zelaya had repeatedly breached the constitution by pushing ahead with a vote about rewriting the nation’s charter that the court ruled illegal, and which opponents contend would have paved the way for a prohibited second term.

...The arrest order she cited, approved unanimously by the court’s 15 justices, was released this afternoon along with documents pertaining to a secret investigation that went on for weeks under the high court’s supervision."

[Hank]

Just like the News calling Golisano a "coup" leader, I said coups are like icebergs, the ones you see are just the tip.
The lesson here is the tenuousness of governments, of all kinds. Watch Fletcher Knebel's "Seven Days in May."
More, how Honduras is dealt with is monumental.
It will be better to read from more independent outside journalists to get a read. There is no right-wrong, black-white, issue here. Anymore than a dictator-democracy Egypt or a puppet-master Afghanistan.
Why was Russia so concerned about Bush-inspired Georgia government?
Those out-of-sight coups are going to be even bigger.

[OPMike]

Why all this American meddling in the internal affairs of Honduras? I thought that Obama doesn't want to “meddle in the internal affairs” of other countries, and that "we're not the policeman of the world, as much as we'd like to think we are."

Will the real Barack Obama please stand up.

[jd]

George
I believe you could write an article a day about Obama making huge blunders or going back on campaign promises. I would like to see more. Today I hear Michelle was seen with a $6,000 designer clutch purse, she is not returning from Russia with hubby she her daughters and her full time make up artist will be taking air force 11 to London for a shopping spree.
I'm sure there are more important things to discuss but you must agree this would be a fun topic. You could start off on the light side then launch into how Obama's multi trillion dollar deficit spending spree will destroy America. Just a thought, have a nice day.

[Hank]

While reserving opinions until issue is much wider discussed, here is a piece from Pajamas Media:
"Ten Days That Shook Honduras" http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/ten-days-that-shook-honduras/by Jim Hoft.

[Hank]

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/ten-days-that-shook-honduras/

[wil]

Some questions... If he was supposedly under arrest or to be arrested... Why was he not jailed and given a trial? you know ..due process... Why was he escorted out of the country? Or was his trial given to him when the military was escorting him from his bedroom to his plane? Secondly, If their Constitution is similar to ours... Is there not an impeachment process that should have been enacted...The whole thing does sound very fishy...

[Reality Check]

wil --

They're not as established a republic as the U.S. is (very few nations are), so that's not a reasonable standard.

Bu this guy Zelaya was obvously trying to make it even worse than it is. He was flagrantly violating their constitution by attempting to extend his term and disobeying court orders to cease and desist his unconstitutional actions in that regard.

They didn't kill him or harm him, and they offered to let him stay there if he'd resign. Their measures were extreme to fly him to another country, but they felt what he was doing was extreme and unconstitutional as well.