Cash for clunkers
The "Cash for Clunkers" program, designed to get customers to trade in less fuel-efficient vehicles for more fuel-efficient ones, is working its way through Congress. The program would provide vouchers of up to $4,500 toward the purchase of new vehicles, as long as the deal meets eligibility requirements based on fuel economy standards and the price of the new vehicle.
It has generated considerable debate. Backers say it will help take gas guzzlers off the road for good, since they would be scrapped, and give the new-car business a much-needed boost. Critics say the program is a poor use of taxpayer dollars or doesn't go far enough in its requirements for fuel economy.
What are your thoughts on the program? Do you intend to take advantage of it if it goes into effect?
-- Matt Glynn
Wait, so we've already shoveled tens of billions into these failing automakers --- money we will NEVER see back, and now we're giving them billions more in taxpayer subsidy cash? Does any rational person actually think this is going to even reduce the price of these cars instead of magically propping up the sales price $4k?
Forget that. They made their bed, they can lie in it. I'm tired of doing the right thing and paying for everybody else.
Posted by: Rob | June 18, 2009 at 10:26 AM
As the article pointed out, many people with older models would not qualify. I checked some government mileage ratings and they are questionable in themselves, for 1996 to 2000 models.
Then the vehichles have to be scrapped, a responsibility of the dealer, I understand.
This is flawed from the get-go. I can see how it got past the House. The Senate should reject it.
Posted by: Hank | June 18, 2009 at 10:38 AM
They should call this the Hummer-Cadillac, Crown Victoria, Soccer Mom Bailout Bill.
You get rewarded a lot of government money for purchasing old gas guzzlers. On the other hand if you have been economically prudent and drive an old car this is not quite a gas guzzler you get absolutely nothing.
The arbitrariness of this is exacberated by the Washington bureaucrats who design mileage charts. Where do they test the cars- In South Florida or the Utah desert.? Try to get 21 miles a gallon the highway in the wintertime during a snow storm in a middle sized domestic Ford sedan. It does not get even 18 mph in the city.
If you want to really stimulate the whole economy and not just for morons who bought SUVS and trucks make the incentive more graduated running up to 25 mpg and giving more people the option to purchase new vehicles.
Posted by: Joe Jarzembek | June 18, 2009 at 11:08 AM
Just another ill thought out plan from the millionaires club of law makers.
Sounds like a stretch - that someone driving an old gas guzzler worth less than $3500 -$4500 (because thats all your gonna get - no trade in value because it gets scrapped) is going to all of a sudden have the bucks to buy a brand new car....esp in this time of economic meltdown and shakey job security.
If this lame law is actually passes it should include some provision that states that rather than scrapping ALL the cars....some of the better ones could be better used to help struggling people who cant afford a decent car.....the titles could be branded so they couldnt be transfered after that use and require they go to junkyards and used for PARTS.....to scrap all of them is just wasteful and really shows how out of touch these elitist "leaders" are....how many of them ever go to junkyards to get repair parts for their own cars ???
How much aid to the auto industry is going to be enough?....this is sick already
A property tax cut would better put money in the hands of people who SHOULD be buying new cars - it really doesnt help the economy to repeat the home mortgage meltdown by stuffing people who cant afford to PAY for a new car in one - does it????....after all the hype goes away - how many of these rags to riches people are going to follow thru with the loan commitment and pay for the car - and how many will be repo'd ?????
Dumb Idea !
Posted by: Robert Wendt | June 18, 2009 at 12:24 PM
"Dumb Idea":
First ones on it were Senators Barbara Boxer
and Charles Schumer.
Posted by: Hank | June 18, 2009 at 12:31 PM
Yet another attempt by the government to manipulate people's behavior!
It's time for another revolution: let's get rid of this tyrannical government once and for all.
Posted by: Buffalo Libertarian | June 18, 2009 at 12:41 PM
A trillion here... A trillion there... Who cares!!! We'll just print more money. They have actually found a way to spend more money in 6 months than was previously spent in the past 200 years!!!! That is actaully hard to do. How else did you expect "G"overnment "M"otors to sell more cars to keep the union guys happy. This way you can drive in style to the doctors for your Obama Care. Wow... Hope all the changes are working out for everyone...
Posted by: Dave | June 18, 2009 at 01:13 PM
Dear Buffalo Libertarian, better be careful with what you say on these boards. You might be visited by ACORN one of these nights...... Oh that's right, they will visit everyone since they will be given the 2010 census contract.
Posted by: gravedancer | June 18, 2009 at 06:59 PM
American tax dollars should not be used to subsidize foreign autos, especially at a time we have hundreds of thousands of American auto, steel, tire and glass and component workers on lay off or being permanently discharged.
Down with Honda, Kia, Toyota, Hyundai, etc - time to protect American industries and workers. Time for 40 % duty tariffs on foreign autos and auto parts.
Posted by: Mike Phelan | June 18, 2009 at 10:56 PM
Another stupid idea, I said months ago why not reward anyone who buys or orders a new US made in the next 60 days 3 or $4,000 ? That may have saved Chrysler and Gm, the car lots would have been buzzing and auto workers would be working overtime, Obama is a fool. Why has Obama been so silent with no grand speech in support of the protestors in Iran ? They are looking for support from the West and Obama is silent. Are Obamas teleprompters in for repair ?
What a perfect time for one of his PEOPLE OF THE WORLD SPEECHES.
Posted by: jd | June 18, 2009 at 11:22 PM
It's a ridiculous bill. The Senate should reject it.
If you own a 1996 Honda Civic, which is 13 years old and starting to rust out, you get...NOTHING! That's right! ZERO! Because it starts at 23 and ends at 28.
They should factor in the AGE of the vehicle, too. Older cars get cruddier gas mileage as the years drag on, requiring more and more upkeep, expenses, and costs.
Truly, this is the dumbest idea I've ever seen. If you were reasonably fuel efficient before, your reward is nothing, so you are punished for the chowder heads (Sorry, chowder heads) who bought SUVs and threw all that pollution into the air in the first place.
There's no reward like being punished for doing the right thing and staying with compact cars in the first place. Thanks, House of Representatives.
Posted by: Economical and Screwed | June 19, 2009 at 07:34 AM
The environmental funds comes from the funds that Bush set up for car efficiency programs. That's also where the bailout money came from. I can bet also that you have to have top of the line credit. I haven't heard this or seen it yet. Does anyone know? I bought my car in 2006 cash. Its nice not to have a car payment. I also assume this money would be a down payment for another vehicle that sounds like a 27,000 car. Just more credit on the books down the line. If I don't have cash I don't buy it. I wait until I could.
Posted by: nykaren | June 19, 2009 at 07:54 AM
This is another reversal in Obama's "pay as you go" policy for government spending. He should change it to "spend now and hope you (ie.the taxpayer) can pay for it later."
Posted by: Don H | June 19, 2009 at 09:35 AM
It is becoming increasing clear - that the irresponsible are rewarded in this society.......to go even farther ....many of them are elected to high office
what are they thinking?....keep spending money on stupid things and keep printing more - pretty soon our money will be worth as much as Confederate.
with all the people hit hard by this meltdown and the many jobs that were lost and never coming back & those that remain always in peril .....wouldnt it make more sense to help with necessities or reduce expenses like taxes - so people could stay in their homes?......buying a NEW car is something you do when you can afford it and need it - not when the Govt decides it time......
WHY are all these programs TARGETED.....the $8k for a new house - first time buyers ....this program targeted to certain year cars and a foolishly small increase in MPG........if they want to sell houses and cars - how about including everyone ????
Posted by: Robert Wendt | June 19, 2009 at 12:47 PM
This fool Obama is like a ping pong ball he bounces all over with no clear direction.
Dave was right in the last 6 months Obama has spent more or has plans to spend more than all 43 presidents before him.
His poll #s are dropping with good reason.
What this country must fear is that Obama will try to force his foolish dangerous ideas with the support of Pelosi and Reid before the next elections.
The color of the sky Obama views is different from main stream americans, just read the two books this guy wrote, he had very radical anti military anti white views.
He ran as a moderate some would even say right of center but he didn't change he's still the same guy who wrote those books only a few years ago.
I expect the shovel ready projects might get started just before election time that will make a great back drop for Obama wearing a hard hat saying see,,,,America is on the move. I feel many are starting to see the real tax and spend machine, it's safe to say Obama is the king of tax and spend this country has never seen anything like it. Inflation will doom Obama and the rest of the country right along with him.
Posted by: jd | June 19, 2009 at 02:53 PM
I don't qualify because my car already gets good gas mileage. My dad swears by the car buying process here: http://excarsalesman.typepad.com/ It is kind of similar.
I haven't tried it yet, but I might because it looks good.
I have a feeling dealers are going to automatically increase prices because of the increased demand (artificial) for lower MPG cars. So the thousands of savings from this bill for consumers is not entirely accurate. The demand will increase prices and you'll get a voucher from increased prices. I'm certain some markets you'll come out even as if they never offered this voucher. It is poorly written legislation.
Posted by: Jordan | June 19, 2009 at 11:55 PM
All Congress has to do to stimulate cars sales is just allow taxpayers who donate car to charity to claim the book value on their taxes. This way all cars are eligible and car dealers, taxpayers and charities all benefit!
Posted by: karenc | June 29, 2009 at 11:42 AM
It is not the consumer. While good intentions may win some, it is what is really happening with this program that is troubling. There are scams and more. See, http://butasforme.com/2009/07/17/cash-for-clunkers-the-ultimate-bait-and-switch-marketing-tool/
Posted by: Janet | July 18, 2009 at 04:17 PM
Car dealers are increasing prices for good MPG cars because of the increased demand (artificial) from the cash for clunkers program. Not being critical, but it is basic supply/demand economics.
With the price increases, some markets will will give consumers no net benefit. It is poorly written legislation. Especially since the turned in cars have a trade-in value of equal the scrap metal — because all cars under this program must be taken off the road. So some cars that qualify, may actually be worth more than the redemable voucher.
I don’t qualify for cash for clunkers because my car already gets good gas mileage. But my dad swears by the car buying process here:
http://tinyurl.com/laub3m
Posted by: Trey | July 25, 2009 at 01:47 PM